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3/9/2010 10:38:30 AM
 
letsgotigers
11 Posts
Joined 02/08/2010
Entry Type:
Issue
Category:
Families
Subcategory:
General
Brick Arches  

 I’ve created some brick arches and sills for a Revit model but have been banging my head over one issue; how to void out that section of the brick veneer where the header and sill occur, so that everything looks correct in the building project that the arch is loaded into. Regarding the arch, my latest attempt was to:

 
  1. create a Generic Model, then make the arch as a solid sweep from a previously created brick profile family.
  2. I then loaded the arch into a Wall-Based Generic Model, aligning the back of the arch with the reference plane, and then created a Void Sweep in the wall exactly where the arch is
  3. Result: first, in the Wall Based Generic Model, the void in the wall doesn’t really appear as a void (did the void not get applied to the wall?), and second, when I loaded the Generic Model into the project and placed it (above arched window) using Place Component, the arch appears in the section, but the wall was not cut where the arch occurs. This is more of a problem at sloped brick sills, where the brick in the wall just carries right through the brick sill.
I also tried loading the brick arch into the window family, but got the same result; the arch shows up but the wall does not void out.
 
Do you have any suggestions – is there a better way to do this that works? Let me know if you need screen shots to better explain.
3/9/2010 10:48:42 AM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

Any chance you would be willing to upload the wall-based family for me to look at?

I am pretty sure you just need to "cut" the void into the wall in the family.  When you do, it should act that way in the project.  There is a cut tool in Revit...not sure which version you are using or I'd tell you where it's at...

I have done this before, so don't fret too much, we should be able to get this to work.

_______________
superJMuser
3/9/2010 10:51:31 AM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

to clarify, the voids don't usually (in my experience) automatically cut walls or nested geometry, only solid geometry that is "live" in that family.  If you use the "cut" tool as I mentioned in previous post, and cut the wall with the void, it should work.  I think you have to just pick the void and the wall while the tool is activated, and let Revit do the rest of the magic...

_______________
superJMuser
3/9/2010 11:08:00 AM
 
letsgotigers
11 Posts
Joined 02/08/2010
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  superJMuser

I have attached the Revit model families. The third family is the wall-based generic model where I tried to void sweep out the wall at the arch loaction. The fourth (and final) attachment is where I tried to load the brick arch into the window family.

Let me know your suggestions.

Thanks.

 
Attachments Summary List
Brick Jack Arch 5-8 NEW2.rfa;Brick Jack Arch Profile 5-8.rfa;Wall Based Brick Jack Arch 5-8.rfa;5-8 x 8-0 Window w Sill - Second Floor.rfa;
Click the attachment icon to left to view & download the Attachments. Please note that it is suggested to use Internet Explorer when downloading attachments to ensure proper file type translation
3/9/2010 11:09:54 AM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

are you using Revit 2010?

_______________
superJMuser
3/9/2010 11:24:42 AM
 
letsgotigers
11 Posts
Joined 02/08/2010
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  superJMuser

Yes, I'm using Revit 2010 - Student Version.

3/9/2010 11:36:48 AM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

see attached...All I did was upload the Window family file, as you can extract the nested families from it.

The "cut" tool like I mentioned worked.  Inside of the Wall Hosted Arch, I just used the cut tool to "cut" the void into the wall.

I also moved the Arch out away from the wall in the wall hosted arch family, so that it sticks out a bit in the Window Family.  I also aligned and locked the void to the reference plane you had drawn, as well as the solid family so that you could control with a dimension the "depth it is set into the wall...I didn't set up this parameter however, but would be glad to walk you through it if you aren't sure.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Always happy to help

_______________
superJMuser
 
Attachments Summary List
Wall Based Brick Jack Arch 5-8 updated.rfa;
Click the attachment icon to left to view & download the Attachments. Please note that it is suggested to use Internet Explorer when downloading attachments to ensure proper file type translation
3/9/2010 1:38:10 PM
 
letsgotigers
11 Posts
Joined 02/08/2010
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  superJMuser

 The void-cut worked, but I have a few more questions:

1) How did you lock the void and solid to the refernce plane?

2) After loading the arch into the project, I then placed the arch (using Place Component) in the project, but the placement point was not where I thought it would be (I thought it would be based on the Ref. Plane 0'-0" of the arch family). What determines the placement point, and how do I change it?

3) Also when I placed the arch component, the brick of the wall still shows up behind the arch, as if the arch brick was transparent (see screen shot attachment). This is even though void-cut worked, and the wall recognizes the void. Do I need to change a materials setting?  

 
Attachments Summary List
Brick Arch in Project - transparent arch problem.jpg;
Click the attachment icon to left to view & download the Attachments. Please note that it is suggested to use Internet Explorer when downloading attachments to ensure proper file type translation
3/9/2010 1:43:26 PM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

Do you mind emailing me the project file to have a look?  Can't quite tell from that image...

_______________
superJMuser
3/9/2010 1:44:59 PM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

sorry, I meant just post it as an attachment...by the way, sorry I don't have all the kinks working out in the forum...it's usually better to add your attachment first, as if you don't and have already typed something in the other tab, you will lose it...if I forget to do that, I just copy it out to notepad, make my attachment and copy it back in.

_______________
superJMuser
3/9/2010 2:12:08 PM
 
letsgotigers
11 Posts
Joined 02/08/2010
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  superJMuser

I just e-mailed you the Revit project file - to RevitForum@revitinfo.com. It's a 19 MB file, so I may take a while to get through. In the meantime, can you let me know how to lock the void and solid to the reference plane?

Thanks for your help.

3/9/2010 2:20:55 PM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

Hi there...that email address is sort-of like a do not reply email address...it takes care of the outgoing mail, but doesn't have an incoming mailbox. 

Can you post the file that in the Forum?  That sze is no problem...just give it a minute or two to finish...I just got done uploading a 38 MB file earlier so I should work fine, and within 2 minutes assuming you are on a good speed internet connection.

I regard to locking the void and solid to the reference plane, the easiest way is to use the align tool.  Select the referenece plane and then the side of the solid or void you want to align.  When you do this, you should see a padlock icon come up.  Click it to lock the geometry to the plane.  Now if the reference plane moves (due to a length parameter you set up changing or something), the geometry will move with it.

_______________
superJMuser
3/9/2010 2:29:06 PM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

The reason the brick is showing through is because you have the material set as brick in the Generic Model family of the Arch (the base Arch).  Even though it doesn't show up in the family (because the family setting is set to not show a surface pattern), the project file probably contains a material with the same name.

If this is the case, the project file setting will control that material, and the project file is probably set to show a surface pattern (like the wall in the image you posted).

You just need to change this to a different material with a unique name that you can control separately from the Brick on the regular wall.

There is a way to make the material a parameter too, so you can change it in the window family to something else (say cast stone or something) if you ever thought you would want to/need to.  There is a bit of a trick involved since you are nesting the family into other families, but if you need to go that route, let me know and I'll walk you through how to do it.

_______________
superJMuser
3/17/2010 12:43:52 PM
 
superJMuser
438 Posts
Joined 08/19/2009
Re: Brick Arches
In Response To:  letsgotigers

Hi, just following up...was anything I posted helpful or make sense?

_______________
superJMuser


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